Governments CONTROL on us...
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naturelover24
- Posts: 130
- Joined: Wed Oct 27, 2010 7:20 am
Governments CONTROL on us...
does anyone agree that the government tries to, in a way, set us in a trap. start from page one; we're born. from then on they feed us, through the media, ideas of what "the good life" should be. we should have a high paying business job, a few kids, a big house. they show it through commercials, movies, tv shows, and certain musicians or famous popstars so many idolize, showcase their love for money and how it brings "happiness." the commercials try to mask the dullness of a job through comedic relief, only to persuade us into this mundane lifestyle. by the time we grow up and are ready for college, we are basically numb to the idea of "the american dream". the government tries to feed us this idea of a good life, as if we all have one, universal opinion on what constitutes a fulfilling life. they dont want us to value things such as people, love, unselfishness, our true passions, yet they want us to value things such as money, possessions, a house, other unfulfilling things. does anyone agree, or care to elaborate, on the deadly effect that is overtaking our nation? so many people dont even take the time to see that they are being brainwashed...
Re: Governments CONTROL on us...
none of that is correct,you make decisions that control your life.you may choose to take the standard path,ie get a job,somewhere to live,have a relationship,have kids and so on.but ultimately you make that decision for yourself.
i dont know what country your from but there are very few that force you to make that decision.
infact this very story proves beyond doubt that you can make a different choice(it may not be conventional),but you can.
infact if you come from america or indeed canada you have by far enough space to just walk off and live in the wilderness.i come from england,there is very little free space if any,but i could still just walk away from my convetial life.just a small point, but the american goverment appears to control its citizens less than most european goverments.
you say magazines show you the ideal image of the american dream,surely that must be a mass dream,not your individual dream.
its your life, you have to take responsibility for it.when your life passes away,ultimately it will only be that you have to thank/blame for how you lived it.
i dont know what country your from but there are very few that force you to make that decision.
infact this very story proves beyond doubt that you can make a different choice(it may not be conventional),but you can.
infact if you come from america or indeed canada you have by far enough space to just walk off and live in the wilderness.i come from england,there is very little free space if any,but i could still just walk away from my convetial life.just a small point, but the american goverment appears to control its citizens less than most european goverments.
you say magazines show you the ideal image of the american dream,surely that must be a mass dream,not your individual dream.
its your life, you have to take responsibility for it.when your life passes away,ultimately it will only be that you have to thank/blame for how you lived it.
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naturelover24
- Posts: 130
- Joined: Wed Oct 27, 2010 7:20 am
Re: Governments CONTROL on us...
any thoughts? we all know chris had certain beliefs on these as well 
Re: Governments CONTROL on us...
All in all, I agree with what scooby wrote. It might be harder to choose a different path, but it's possible. Government does indeed control certain things (like laws - if you break them, you have expect to bear the consequences and so on), but for the rest, it's your own decisions.
Re: Governments CONTROL on us...
Its not so cut and dry.
Media in particular bombards us with messages practically from birth. In North America and the Western World in general the messages are usually intended to make us want to consume goods, own cars etc. for the most part. These messages originate with corporations, they have done considerable research into psychological methods of marketing. There is also a heavy patriotic undertone in a lot of USA produced movies, TV shows etc. Its very subtle psychological brainwashing but its there. Ever notice the brands of cigarettes smoked in Hollywood movies, the subtle endorsements by leading actors?
Government policies etc are often shaped by these influences that come through from powerful lobbyists. Its not always the government that is directing it. These days the government is being directed and manipulated.
As a kid in Canada my parents were often appalled at my pro American beliefs and ideas etc. Even movies like "Old Yeller" a childhood favorite has that proud to be American message built in. Heres a good example, At 8 or 9 I would belt out the Johnny Horton song "Battle of New Orleans" it has a really catchy tune and is an exciting story. My mother tried to correct me because of the anti-British sentiment. Well it was playing on the radio for quite a while and the tune picked you up. Never mind that historically we were loyal to Britain. The US war of Independence was something to be proud of don't you know. You don't always look for the deeper hidden meanings in these things as a kid. But you adopt and accept the beliefs they present into your subconscious. As kids we are exposed to a lot of these subliminal if you will, messages. I recall being caught up in the GI Joe and US Army type comics around that time, we're talking early 1960's here. They were disgusting with the hate messages about "Commies" etc. But I just soaked it all up. Subliminal messages were everywhere. USA was the greatest place on earth and I felt deprived not living there.
At 10 years of age in grade 5 I had developed a very strong sense that the President of the USA was the greatest man in the world. That was constantly presented to us through media messages. Now at the time that man was JFK, so it may well have really been true. To this day I can look back at the wold I knew then and say without a doubt, there was real true and positive hope for the future, for world peace and global security, it was a very positive time, everybody seemed to be doing well, there was full employment and the world felt safe. Kennedy's message was so encouraging, so motivating so convincing "Why go to the moon", "Ask not what your country can do for you" . Then add Martin Luther King "I have a Dream". Those were heady times. I love listening to those old speeches, it gets me fired up to this day, my pro-Americanism.
I can tell you that I remember the exact time and place where I was when I learned that Kennedy had been assassinated. I was just across the street from my public school on my way home, a kid who I don't remember was standing there beside a moose maple shrub that still had red leaves and he told me that Kennedy had been assassinated. I didn't know what the word meant, but I was afraid it meant he was dead. The kid went on to tell me he was dead, had been shot. When I got home I found my mother sobbing. I can tell you that the world I knew changed forever on that day.
Later as an adult having never shook the feeling that the world had been cheated by that event and having seen tabloid headlines etc. over the years that suggested conspiracies, I began to read up and learn more about that whole business. I read many books and participated in online discussions on alt.conspiracy.jfk for a long time. Those were the days before the world wide web, when the internet existed in text form. You needed a University, government or military account to get online. I dialed in from home to the University and logged in to the VAX 11780 mainframe. At that time it was all UNIX. I would go to the newsgroups and go through the list of posts in the jfk group. People were posting comments from all over the world, it was great. There were all kinds of flame wars and fighting, accusations, you name it. I'm sure some on there were CIA trying to discredit the honest researchers, there were published authors like David Lifton and Gerald Posner and lunatics. It was quite an education to be sure. I was absorbed in it for some time. I learned a lot about the way the world is run.
There are some pretty convincing arguments that projects like MK Ultra were very real, that the CIA has been heavily involved in mind control experiments and practices for a very long time. It is said the CIA has a vast network of connections throughout western news media and controls to a great extent the stories and information that is fed to us as news. But who runs the CIA?
Governments change, agendas change, sure they often try hard to steer us. Look at Bush and his Terror campaign, keeping everyone in fear in order to implement homeland security etc. People have lost a lot of freedom, lost a lot of civil rights to the war on terror. But government is being steered and manipulated by the real big players, the biggest players, the corporations with vested interests globally. Its bigger than just one government its now global, driven by corporate greed.
Its not a government plot anymore. Canada tries to stay neutral on a lot of things, tries to negotiate peace, tries to help other countries, be a good global citizen. But increasingly we are being manipulated by the same powerful forces. The world is divided almost in half by a war about oil. Canada has lost 154 Canadians in Afghanistan in what is known here as George Bush's Oil War. People keep asking what are we fighting for over there? Its a known fact that Bin Laden died years ago. The CIA says they haven't had any good intelligence on him for years. He almost certainly died at Bora Bora. But the war on terror is big business so keep the fear going. Keep the price of oil high. Remember, Bush was an oil man.
And it goes beyond government and corporations, religions are always vying to control our thoughts and beliefs, special interest groups try to seduce us, used car salesman love to get a sucker on the line and sell him car after car. Its everywhere.
So we have choices, we have free will if we are willing to risk the insecurity of being independent. A lot of people can't do that. They need to be given direction, they need to feel secure in a belief system.
Its not cut and dry. There is not one overshadowing conspiracy pulling all the strings, there are many competing players wanting to direct as many people as possible for their own ends.
At 20 I swore not to watch TV or ever own one. That lasted a few years. All my adult life I have been resisting and mocking the marketing schemes forever in the media. I have resisted but I have not been able to stand tall and free. I have loyalty to products, I have political beliefs, I have been influenced. We all get caught up in something, even this discussion group. We are all being groomed to buy the next book... repeat after me, I will order the book as soon as it comes out,,, I will order the book as soon as it comes out,,, I will order the book as soon as it comes out,,,
Media in particular bombards us with messages practically from birth. In North America and the Western World in general the messages are usually intended to make us want to consume goods, own cars etc. for the most part. These messages originate with corporations, they have done considerable research into psychological methods of marketing. There is also a heavy patriotic undertone in a lot of USA produced movies, TV shows etc. Its very subtle psychological brainwashing but its there. Ever notice the brands of cigarettes smoked in Hollywood movies, the subtle endorsements by leading actors?
Government policies etc are often shaped by these influences that come through from powerful lobbyists. Its not always the government that is directing it. These days the government is being directed and manipulated.
As a kid in Canada my parents were often appalled at my pro American beliefs and ideas etc. Even movies like "Old Yeller" a childhood favorite has that proud to be American message built in. Heres a good example, At 8 or 9 I would belt out the Johnny Horton song "Battle of New Orleans" it has a really catchy tune and is an exciting story. My mother tried to correct me because of the anti-British sentiment. Well it was playing on the radio for quite a while and the tune picked you up. Never mind that historically we were loyal to Britain. The US war of Independence was something to be proud of don't you know. You don't always look for the deeper hidden meanings in these things as a kid. But you adopt and accept the beliefs they present into your subconscious. As kids we are exposed to a lot of these subliminal if you will, messages. I recall being caught up in the GI Joe and US Army type comics around that time, we're talking early 1960's here. They were disgusting with the hate messages about "Commies" etc. But I just soaked it all up. Subliminal messages were everywhere. USA was the greatest place on earth and I felt deprived not living there.
At 10 years of age in grade 5 I had developed a very strong sense that the President of the USA was the greatest man in the world. That was constantly presented to us through media messages. Now at the time that man was JFK, so it may well have really been true. To this day I can look back at the wold I knew then and say without a doubt, there was real true and positive hope for the future, for world peace and global security, it was a very positive time, everybody seemed to be doing well, there was full employment and the world felt safe. Kennedy's message was so encouraging, so motivating so convincing "Why go to the moon", "Ask not what your country can do for you" . Then add Martin Luther King "I have a Dream". Those were heady times. I love listening to those old speeches, it gets me fired up to this day, my pro-Americanism.
I can tell you that I remember the exact time and place where I was when I learned that Kennedy had been assassinated. I was just across the street from my public school on my way home, a kid who I don't remember was standing there beside a moose maple shrub that still had red leaves and he told me that Kennedy had been assassinated. I didn't know what the word meant, but I was afraid it meant he was dead. The kid went on to tell me he was dead, had been shot. When I got home I found my mother sobbing. I can tell you that the world I knew changed forever on that day.
Later as an adult having never shook the feeling that the world had been cheated by that event and having seen tabloid headlines etc. over the years that suggested conspiracies, I began to read up and learn more about that whole business. I read many books and participated in online discussions on alt.conspiracy.jfk for a long time. Those were the days before the world wide web, when the internet existed in text form. You needed a University, government or military account to get online. I dialed in from home to the University and logged in to the VAX 11780 mainframe. At that time it was all UNIX. I would go to the newsgroups and go through the list of posts in the jfk group. People were posting comments from all over the world, it was great. There were all kinds of flame wars and fighting, accusations, you name it. I'm sure some on there were CIA trying to discredit the honest researchers, there were published authors like David Lifton and Gerald Posner and lunatics. It was quite an education to be sure. I was absorbed in it for some time. I learned a lot about the way the world is run.
There are some pretty convincing arguments that projects like MK Ultra were very real, that the CIA has been heavily involved in mind control experiments and practices for a very long time. It is said the CIA has a vast network of connections throughout western news media and controls to a great extent the stories and information that is fed to us as news. But who runs the CIA?
Governments change, agendas change, sure they often try hard to steer us. Look at Bush and his Terror campaign, keeping everyone in fear in order to implement homeland security etc. People have lost a lot of freedom, lost a lot of civil rights to the war on terror. But government is being steered and manipulated by the real big players, the biggest players, the corporations with vested interests globally. Its bigger than just one government its now global, driven by corporate greed.
Its not a government plot anymore. Canada tries to stay neutral on a lot of things, tries to negotiate peace, tries to help other countries, be a good global citizen. But increasingly we are being manipulated by the same powerful forces. The world is divided almost in half by a war about oil. Canada has lost 154 Canadians in Afghanistan in what is known here as George Bush's Oil War. People keep asking what are we fighting for over there? Its a known fact that Bin Laden died years ago. The CIA says they haven't had any good intelligence on him for years. He almost certainly died at Bora Bora. But the war on terror is big business so keep the fear going. Keep the price of oil high. Remember, Bush was an oil man.
And it goes beyond government and corporations, religions are always vying to control our thoughts and beliefs, special interest groups try to seduce us, used car salesman love to get a sucker on the line and sell him car after car. Its everywhere.
So we have choices, we have free will if we are willing to risk the insecurity of being independent. A lot of people can't do that. They need to be given direction, they need to feel secure in a belief system.
Its not cut and dry. There is not one overshadowing conspiracy pulling all the strings, there are many competing players wanting to direct as many people as possible for their own ends.
At 20 I swore not to watch TV or ever own one. That lasted a few years. All my adult life I have been resisting and mocking the marketing schemes forever in the media. I have resisted but I have not been able to stand tall and free. I have loyalty to products, I have political beliefs, I have been influenced. We all get caught up in something, even this discussion group. We are all being groomed to buy the next book... repeat after me, I will order the book as soon as it comes out,,, I will order the book as soon as it comes out,,, I will order the book as soon as it comes out,,,
There is no greater scripture than nature, for nature is life itself.
Re: Governments CONTROL on us...
Bob-
what you wrote and explained is very eye opening for me. I thank you for your personal insight on the subject, you pointed out some very valid points.
what you wrote and explained is very eye opening for me. I thank you for your personal insight on the subject, you pointed out some very valid points.
Re: Governments CONTROL on us...
ellisd wrote:Bob-
what you wrote and explained is very eye opening for me. I thank you for your personal insight on the subject, you pointed out some very valid points.
Hey thanks,
We are lucky to live in a so called free society. Some countries like China, Saudi Arabia and others have overwhelming doctrines and dictates with harsh laws and punishments for those who step out of line. Look at the famous video of the lone protester stepping in front of the tank in Tienanmen Square. They probably took him out and shot him the next day. But he made a lasting impression against a harsh regime.
Thought control exists to many degrees in many forms. It easy enough for me to look back and realize that I was being influenced at different times. Naturelover24 is right about the hidden messages and brainwashing in the media etc. Except its not all part of one big diabolical plot, at least not in the Western World. There are many competing strategists. We have too many radicals and free thinkers running free and influencing people to "march to the beat of a different drummer". Still there are many factions competing for our attention and money and it changes over time. Our governments will try to varying degrees to shape and direct peoples loyalties and beliefs, the cold war propaganda for example that I grew up with. Today its the threat of terrorism.
I can also warn you about another trap. I was the right age to go to Vietnam, my generation were the ones fighting over there. Of course I lived in Canada and escaped the draft, but some of us Canadians actually went down to the US and signed up. I think they read the GI Joe comics too much. Anyhow I got very much caught up in the whole Anti-Vietnam, hippie, peace, love, weed, protest movement if you will. The thinking was all against "the man", against "the establishment" against "The military industrial complex" basically against everything. So the long hair and the flowery clothes the weed and the free love, the refusal to take a straight job, it all caught up with me and I got to spend some time at another kind of institution. The Peace movement really didn't do me any good, Jimmy Hendrix, James Morrison and Eric Clapton didn't come to rescue me. The Beatles didn't even care. In my rebellion against the establishment and all the values my parents stood for, I lost my own direction.
Its good to stand against bad things, but one also needs to stand for something. Rebellion just for rebellions sake leads to ruin.
There is no greater scripture than nature, for nature is life itself.
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naturelover24
- Posts: 130
- Joined: Wed Oct 27, 2010 7:20 am
Re: Governments CONTROL on us...
YEah the government and media have definitely screwed so many over. everyone is the same these days!! anyone have any other thoughts on mass media control/brainwashing??
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naturelover24
- Posts: 130
- Joined: Wed Oct 27, 2010 7:20 am
Re: Governments CONTROL on us... Chris' thoughts..
anymore thoughts for anyone?? chris had very abstract views and unique ones toward society and the government and peoples motives...
Re: Governments CONTROL on us...
I think this can be related to Chris Mcandless because he felt controlled growing up with his parents telling him how he was supposed to be, feel, act, and portray himself to others. Apparently, they were the typical brainwashed americans who thrived on acquiring and flaunting material things in exchange for a self-esteem.
We are a brainwashed society. Do you ever notice that foreign people and foreign countries tend to be more honest and frank about things? It is like a breath of fresh air when speaking to them about realistic views and issues.
I think the government and advertising-ie. Television is always sumbliminal to get us to spend (or waste our money to make the fat cats fatter.) Just try not watching tv for 6 months to a year and you will view everything differently and much clearer.
We are a brainwashed society. Do you ever notice that foreign people and foreign countries tend to be more honest and frank about things? It is like a breath of fresh air when speaking to them about realistic views and issues.
I think the government and advertising-ie. Television is always sumbliminal to get us to spend (or waste our money to make the fat cats fatter.) Just try not watching tv for 6 months to a year and you will view everything differently and much clearer.
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