Carine McCandless is writing a memoir...

There is a new book by Carine called The Wild Truth. There will be, no doubt, a lot of talk about this book and its contents, so thought I would create a new category for it.
marcym
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Joined: Wed Jan 12, 2011 10:05 pm

Re: Carine McCandless is writing a memoir...

Postby marcym » Wed Dec 03, 2014 2:58 pm

Hi there, I've read Carine's book too.
As you, I am also still a bit reticent about the relation she shared with Chris...I've cried my eyes out reading that in many years they only shared some letters, even if Chris didn't have a phone, the college has one, for sure, how is it possible that she never felt the need to hear her brother's voice for so much time...why she didn't talk with him about her first marriage, but took him totally out of her very important event? Only later, after he phoned her asking explanations, she realized that Chris was not informed directly about it, he didn't know nothing of her marriage, that he was probably informed by their parents... Ok, she was young and often brothers don't need to talk because are able to understand each others anyway, but almost ignoring themselves even for so important things it seems very sad and so painful to me and even not knowing him personally I suppose he felt not so happy about it.
Then after many years (too many under my point of view) she finally met Chris for his graduation and he spoken openly with her about his intentions to break soon or later the ties with their parents, but he never mentioned to quit with her too...so when he disappeared, is it really possible that she didn't feel the urgence to contact him? She was not living anymore with their parents so why he never contacted her, but just preferred ignore her? 'Go North', you tried to answer to this question assuming that the cause was their weird family environment, but if this is the real reason that brought them to love each others in a so 'untold' way...why Chris enjoyed in contacting all the people he considered friends as Jane, Ron and Wayne? And not at all her? I'm sorry but there is something I really don't get, maybe it's only my fault maybe a limit of my comprehension but up to me, what's written in the new book is not the 100% truth or at least the truth is not said in certain parts.

Carine wrote that her business grew up fast in the years of Chris disappearance, and she had a very good income, if so, and she and Chris were still so incredibly tied as when they were children, why she didn't hire an investigator by herself, paying with her own money to increase the probability to find Chris? Not with the aim to violate his choice, and also without saying a word to their parents (to be sure to be respectful toward Chris within her attempt to find him), with the intent to know that he was fine and happy!!! This part really upset me! And tears fall down thinking how much alone Chris really was, and felt.
Also do you remember in those years how many violent crimes happened?! I really couldn't image myself as sister of a vanished brother in those times, in Carine shoes, doing nothing at all, even having money to can do some extra research, not knowing if my brother had an aggression or worse and needs my help.
I think that all of us need to feel loved! That someone we care about it, shares the joy of his/her life with us, so that we are sure we're part of that joy, surrounded by that feeling of love. To be ignored it's painful and to ignore it's cruel, I personally ignore people I really don't get along with, or when they are horrible but if a person I love starts to ignore me I wonder why, simply because the love and simply because that person is so important for me!

GoNorth
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Re: Carine McCandless is writing a memoir...

Postby GoNorth » Wed Dec 03, 2014 5:28 pm

Thank you for your comments, marcym!

marcym wrote: I've cried my eyes out reading that in many years they only shared some letters, even if Chris didn't have a phone, the college has one, for sure, how is it possible that she never felt the need to hear her brother's voice for so much time...


Honestly, this is a thing that doesn’t seem strange to me at all. It really depends on the kind of relationship you have with your brother or sister, and then it’s also natural that there can be times with more and times with less frequent contact, depending on the respective phase of life. When I was in my early twenties, I spend some time abroad and hardly ever called (or got called by) my brother and we virtually never wrote each other. I only saw him when I went home about twice a year, and everything was fine, we discussed our respective lives and all that, and we definitely never felt ignored by one another.
Ok, if one of us had gotten married, it would have been a different story ;) , I totally agree.
AND: It’s ok not to be regularly in touch, as long as you know exactly that and how/where you COULD contact the other person at any time, if needed.
But that situation changed - at least on one side – for Carine and Chris once he had left on his journey without leaving any trace.

marcym wrote:...so when he disappeared, is it really possible that she didn't feel the urgence to contact him? She was not living anymore with their parents so why he never contacted her, but just preferred ignore her? 'Go North', you tried to answer to this question assuming that the cause was their weird family environment, but if this is the real reason that brought them to love each others in a so 'untold' way...why Chris enjoyed in contacting all the person he considered friends as Jane, Ron and Wayne? And not at all her?


Yes, I think that the cause was their family history, but, of course, that’s just a vague assumption; no idea how exactly it affected which specific part of their personalities.
I just imagine that on Chris’s side, he had decided to get himself a new name and some kind of new identity, and those guys like Wayne, Jan, Ron, etc. were part of his “new” life in which he tried to build up new friendships and all that. Carine was part of his “old” life, so that could explain why he preferred not to contact her, at least for a certain time (I suppose he would have contacted her eventually, if he had survived and managed to get out of the Alaskan bush).
But then again, I believe that both Chris and Carine naturally should have felt the need to get in touch after a while, just in order to check on each other, to see if they're ok. Carine should indeed have started to worry whether anything bad might have happened to Chris, and as it was clear that she couldn’t contact him, he should have thought about contacting her just to reassure her. And Chris as the protective older brother should also have been interested in whether Carine might need her brother for any kind of trouble she might have gotten into in the meantime. But he didn’t do anything. So that’s where I think this (sort of) lacking sense of responsibility (or something like that), learned from their parents, came in and prevented him from realizing that his behaviour might hurt his sister.
And Carine, who probably somehow suffered in silence, never blamed her brother for this, as she had learned to forgive any kind of stuff - and much worse stuff than that...


marcym wrote:…, why she didn't hire an investigator by herself, paying with her own money to increase the probability to find Chris, not with the aim to violate his choice, and also without saying a word to their parents (to be sure to be respectful toward Chris within her attempt to find him), only with the intent to know that he was fine and happy!!! It's this part that really upset me! And tears fall down thinking how much alone Chris really was, and felt.


Why, in this context, do you think that Chris felt so alone?
For the investigator, I don’t know, but my impression is that this was simply not Carine’s style.

But I just had an idea: Maybe we could set up a list of questions to Carine from the users of this board?

marcym
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Re: Carine McCandless is writing a memoir...

Postby marcym » Thu Dec 04, 2014 4:11 pm

Hi there,

I think that Chris felt the weight of lonliness thinking at the kind of poor communication they had in his family, about the fact that probably he left without contacting no one because he didn't feel so loved, it's not about his travel or his new life as Alex.

GoNorth, I understand your point but about asking questions to Carine I won't do, I've gained many important lessons from Chris story and all I want keep high in my mind it's about him, his courage, his charisma, not accusations and fightings in the McCandless family.

Carine is very courteous for sharing with us new pictures, and anecdotes about Chris, it's also right that his fans know facts like when his parents spread his ashes, not caring at all that he wouldn't have liked the place, the last very unforgivable lack of respect for their son! It's horrible! Honestly horrible...

I think that this book was a marvellous idea, even if in certain points I found the accusation towards her parents to be very serious. She wrote a new book with the intent to put end at the prejudices some people still have, about why Chris really left, explaining that he was not a selfish, a psychotic and somehow crazy; in this new book it's much more evident the domestic violence they suffered and probably, by on she will use her book to discuss about violence during her invitation at the many schools throughout the country. Talking more about her personal experience and this is fair.
Perhaps the students will purchase also her book and this is great, not only for her and her daughters but also for her other siblings.
I really hope, really, from the bottom of my heart, that she will share at least the 50% of the book earnings with Shelly who needs help in behalf of her little boy, that has a brain tumor.
I think Chris would have been be very proud of Carine if she will do so.

I've always known Chris was a special person, since the first time I've watched ITW (one of my favourite) and then I've read Jon Krakauer's book (fantastic book).
I'm not saying Carine is not, I was very touched reading about her attachment to Heather, she's clearly a very good person, unfortunately not many stepmoms are like her!
But simply I find her truth not 100% credible under my prospective: during Chris college years they were not living in the other side of the world, not so far away one to another, so was not so difficult to stay in touch but anyway they had have very sporadic contacts, as she wrote in her book, and she even hadn't informed Chris she felt in love with the Irish guy that she was going to marry... :shock:
I don't have any rights to investigate their relationships, because despite all the strange things...as the one above, surely they loved each other, I'm not saying they didn't but perhaps not in the way she describes, and I found this to be strange as the book is entitled 'The Wild TRUTH', but it's only my opinion, it's not so important at all! Her book is not related to my opinion on Chris or the admiration I have for him.

My thoughts about Carine's book: I appreciated some chapters but I didn't like others.

For example I don't understand what's the point to quote some kind of sexual harassment someone in her family suffered for, without saying who is this person. It's confusing understand a truth in some points only suggested ( what exactly Walt has done? Who exactly he importuned? Was their beautiful aunt? Billie's young sister or some of his sons or grandchildren?)...or it's about Chris??? I understood this book was about him and in some pages it's true but for all the rest of the book it's only about how horrible their parents are, how fake they are, and all the problems she and her siblings had dealing with a mad couple, that she defines 'THE SHOW'...

I don't judge people that I personally don't know but the description of them was shoking for me as well as other info.
Last edited by marcym on Sat Dec 06, 2014 4:54 pm, edited 2 times in total.

GoNorth
Posts: 258
Joined: Wed Jan 13, 2010 3:47 pm

Re: Carine McCandless is writing a memoir...

Postby GoNorth » Sat Dec 06, 2014 11:06 am

marcym wrote:
But simply I find her truth not 100% credible under my prospective:
...
I don't have any rights to investigate their relationships, because despite all the strange things...as the one above, surely they loved each other, I'm not saying they don't but perhaps not in the way she describes,


So you think she somehow lied about their relationship? And Chris as well, in that case (when during his journey he told people about his sister and their relationship)? I mean, 100% is always difficult to tell, but personally I have no reason to suspect that she left out any important stuff on purpose.


marcym wrote: but for all the rest of the book it's only about how horrible their parents are, how fake they are, and all the problems she and her siblings had dealing with a mad couple, that she defines 'THE SHOW'...


And I think that after all, this is the most important part of the whole story, and I think that exactly THAT had to be told in detail. How over years and decades and long after they had been forced to stop the physical violence, the psychological violence went on and on, and their denial of all the facts went on, their recurrent disrespectful attitude towards their kids, in so many different situations; and then they put the blame on their victims, and probably still do so to this day; this is so disgusting! And you can't get the overall picture across, if you only share few situations. I'm sure there are still lots of expericences she didn't write about, because otherwise the book would probably have become too big. ;)
Anyway, even though there are actually parts that I found less interesting (like details about playing with her own kids), every detail she wrote about their parents seemed worth telling to me. And as she wrote in what seems to be one of her last letters to them (see pages 250):
"Eight children remember it that way."


By the way, I just found an interesting interview with Carine:
http://nomore.org/learn-family-struggles-sparked-epic-wild-adventure/

marcym
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Re: Carine McCandless is writing a memoir...

Postby marcym » Sat Dec 06, 2014 4:45 pm

Hello,

I think that even not being an English speaker I wrote quite clearly my point, then of course anyone is free to interpreting in the way they prefer.
I've never said that Carine is a liar...there could be many reasons for describing their relationship much better than it was, as for example her current job...but I am not saying she is a total liar, I had only the personal impression she made the things nicer than they really were, it's only my personal opinion, sorry in case you got bad things from the whole post.

Anyway, as far as I know, Chris never said he still had an amazing and unique relationship with her sister, the same tie they had during their childhood as you wrote (Chris said so...) as far as I know he only told the people that he had a very pretty sister he was very proud of when they were kids and the other guys turned their head looking at her beauty, sorry but I missed that Chris said he felt understood and loved from her and in fault for leaving her behind without contacting her, even if they had a so special tie and he didn't need to contact her for this reason...
As well as I am not able at the moment to recall to my mind that he's ever mentioned the other siblings a single time saying they were so tied to one another.

The main reason I felt confused about reading of 'The Show' was that without realizing so, in somehow they are using Chris again...for their business and fights, and this behavior is not so much better than the one Billie had, when accusing Chris of her troubles that she remembered started with his born put him down all the times, what I personally see now it's that they continue to involve him in fightings they even had when he was died from decades...this is the reason why I consider not really related within Chris story and I don't like it.
I understand why talking about their difficult childhood, and that he was not considered from their parents, that they didn't see him as a man, a son, but it seems they saw him more like a thing to manage as they preferred; I understand the witness over not respecting him also after death, spreading his ashes in deep water he was terrified of after the accident occurred in Mexico, I also understand many other things but not all, as writing a book pretending is about Chris McCandless and read then that's 85% about Carine and other McCandless siblings and 'The Show' (I don't hide that reading about Walt's marijuana made me laugh a lot)...but...
in poor words and without accusing anyone or even saying they are all liars, I got my personal opinion about the whole situation, sorry if someone felt accused or offended as was not my intention, but honestly I still think Chris left because felt not loved and also not understood from all his family members (included Carine).

Despite all my excuses and suppositions, please only to consider that the only person able to say the REAL TRUTH about his death and his story would have been CHRIS, not others and I don't think he would have liked this book, maybe the aim but not really all the contents, but this is only my personal idea, we'll never know.

Sorry again if someone felt offended from my thoughts but I felt hurt as perhaps others for seeing again Chris used in somehow after more than 20 years of his death, or maybe I'm the only one to be sad for this.

M.

GoNorth
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Re: Carine McCandless is writing a memoir...

Postby GoNorth » Sat Dec 06, 2014 6:26 pm

marcym wrote:I've never said that Carine is a liar...there could be many reasons for describing their relationship much better than it was, as for example her current job...but I am not saying she is a total liar, I had only the personal impression she made the things nicer than they really were, it's only my personal opinion, sorry in case you got bad things from the whole post.


No, don't worry, I think I got what you meant, it's rather the word "lying" that was probably to harsh (sorry for that), but I just didn't find another word (and that's why I added "somehow"). So I meant the same thing, as you said "making things nicer than they really were", but I still don't have the impression that she modified the facts deliberately in order to draw a nicer picture or so.
So if she did somehow draw a nicer picture, then it was probably rather a subconscious thing. Which is also part of what I meant by that relational "damage" they got from how their parents had treated them.
So I really believe that she told the story the way she really experienced it personally. And that any missing parts (to complete those 100%) are probably things she isn't really aware of herself.

marcym wrote:Anyway, as far as I know, Chris never said he still had an amazing and unique relationship with her sister, the same tie they had during their childhood as you wrote (Chris said so...) as far as I know he only told the people that he had a very pretty sister he was very proud of when they were kids and the other guys turned their head looking at her beauty, sorry but I missed that Chris said he felt understood and loved from her and in fault for leaving her behind without contacting her, even if they had a so special tie and he didn't need to contact her for this reason...


Oh, this is difficult now, as I haven't re-read Krakauer's book in a while, but I think he said something about their special bond to someone. However, I'm quite sure that, at least in the book, he never mentioned that he regretted the way he left her.

marcym wrote:As well as I am not able at the moment to recall to my mind that he's ever mentioned the other siblings a single time saying they were so tied to one another.


True. There was nothing in Krakauer's book about that at all.

marcym wrote: in somehow they are using Chris again...for their business and fights, and this behavior is not so much better than the one Billie had, when accusing Chris of her troubles that she remembered started with his born put him down all the times, what I personally see now it's that they continue to involve him in fightings ...


Ok, that's probably true somehow.
Still I think that that was not the intention and that it was a good thing to tell the story, in order to rectify certain things once and for all (maybe also partly because of the publication of "Back to the wild" a few years ago).

alexbatty
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Re: Carine McCandless is writing a memoir...

Postby alexbatty » Tue Dec 30, 2014 8:56 am

wooooow. i am a survivor of violent child abuse.this is light weight stuff here. woooow.all this blah blah blah over a kid who was too stupid to know where he was going.fools rush in.impetuous thinking killed this man.i understand the desire to wander and roam but common sense must prevail.or one may die in a bus.natural selection.mr big explorer hunter had no idea of his surroundings for he did not get a half mile from the bus.did not take enough food against advice.had no map.this man is not anyone to be admired.he perished very young of stupidity.get a grip people.the family may not be better off but the world is.

FACE
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Re: Carine McCandless is writing a memoir...

Postby FACE » Wed Jun 10, 2015 4:39 pm

erikhalfacre wrote:Carine's book was on the shelf at the Barnes and Noble here in Anchorage the day before it was scheduled to be released. I bought it, took it home, and spent the rest of the evening reading it.

From having talked to Carine on a couple of different camping trips, and heard her talk about her brother, I had gathered enough to assume that their father Walt was abusive, in a classic narcissistic personality disorder sort of way. I think Sean Penn did a decent job alluding to that without spelling it out specifically, Jon to a lesser degree in his book.

Despite all of that though, this book was shocking to me. It was a pretty rough read, not really enjoyable at all. Carine wrote the book in a compelling enough manner, and I was certainly driven to keep turning the page, but the subject matter was just really emotionally charged. Anyone who reads this book, especially the passages from Chris' letters, will have no trouble understanding why he would want to 'divorce' his parents and leave them to wonder where he might be and what he might be doing.

It wasn't about being hateful and seeking revenge, it was about hurting them enough to shock them into reassessing their behavior, and if the desired result was not achieved, at least he'd be rid of them. This is often the motivation of children of narcissists. They are desperate to feel the love of their self-absorbed parent(s) and sometimes choose to do things that seem mean and spiteful, in order to try and affect change. The thing to understand is that as extreme as it may appear, they've already tried talking it over, reasoning it out, and smaller forms of rebellion and they just want a real relationship with their parents, something that in all likelihood they will simply never be able to achieve at any meaningful level.

Not having known Chris, I, like most of the world, will never be able to say I truly understood what made Chris do what he did and how he did it, but Carine's book makes the picture a lot less fuzzy.


Sorry to necro a 5 year old post, but you've described living in the world of a Narcissist perfectly.

Having dated someone with Borderline Personality disorder (which is one in the same as a narcissist), I can attest to what Chris might have been going through at the time that he needed to "divorce" himself from his parents. Sadly, forma psychological point of view, that is the only way possible to deal with monsters like this, is to completely walk away from them, as the rest of the siblings just recently did. It's unfortunate that Billie than goes from becoming a victim to an enabler.

Just watching some of the answers they give in the movie "Back to the Wild", you don't have to look far to see how self absorbed they (Walt and Billie) are and continue to become. One of the symptoms of a narcissist is also that they lack any form of empathy, and to think that they believed that when Chris wrote he was coming out of the wild, that he would be going to see THEM is so self absorbed, it's deploring. There was no going back (TO THAT) for Chris.

Being a victim of a narcissist is never completely understood until you've lived and experienced it for yourself. Truly experienced it!!!!!

Cheers,
FACE

Elenochkafogueddy
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Carine McCandless is writing a memoir

Postby Elenochkafogueddy » Mon Mar 07, 2016 9:38 pm

What did you think of Meek’s style of writing and storytelling?
Дивергент глава 3 За стеной (2016) http://vk.cc/4T0qGq


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